Philosophy of the Matrix

[Static]

Originally posted by cxoli
What do you mean? That his death was saved for the end of the third movie? Still, what I'm talking about is that for the character of Neo, his death was, in a sense, his own choice. I mean, it's not like he had to go into the very center of the machine city....

Neo did have to go to the machine world because he had to return to to source. And the source of Neo was the machine world.

otmo... the russian
I dont get it, if machines killed Smith by sending electric shock through neo who was infected, then why didnt they just take any other infected human and give him/her a shock?

I think you totally missed the point of that part. That was just a cool effect to show smith dying. When smith died in the first one, he was suppose to return to the source but didn't, he came back to kill neo, Then once he killed Neo his purpose was done. And like that arab guy in the train station said. "if a program doesn't have a purpose it gets deleted."

 

[Above_70Percent]

My First post in a while lets see how it turns out.

My views on the Matrix is that its just a Movie. Made by a human being. Yes it is a very deep movie, but it's still just a movie. Basically I just think its about interpreting simple human life in a more complex way.

I enjoy what Static pointed out with the program being deleted. I think that was just another way of saying "when a human has done what he needed to do in life, he dies." But maybe thats just me..... There are alot of hidden messages in this movie that keeps you thinking, thats why the movie is so popular.

And no Lotr was not better then the matrix. Lotr was just plain and simple about a ring. The Matrix is alot more in depth into human beliefs and many many other things.

 

[Plumpamania]

Originally posted by Above_70Percent
And no Lotr was not better then the matrix. Lotr was just plain and simple about a ring. The Matrix is alot more in depth into human beliefs and many many other things.

Lol, if it is a simple as a ring (you idiot) then Matrix is just based off a video game. Plain and simple. If you think that LoTR wasn't into human beliefs, feelings, battles, inner battles, and personifications and much more than you are on a level with an ashtray when it comes to intelligence. Go read the books and come back if you want to compete.

 

[cxoli]

Neo did have to go to the machine world because he had to return to to source. And the source of Neo was the machine world.

I don't know, I still think it was his choice because he knew it was the only way to save Zion. In a sense, he did "have" to, but it was still his own conscious decision. No one else was forcing him to do it.

I think you totally missed the point of that part. That was just a cool effect to show smith dying. When smith died in the first one, he was suppose to return to the source but didn't, he came back to kill neo, Then once he killed Neo his purpose was done. And like that arab guy in the train station said. "if a program doesn't have a purpose it gets deleted."

That's a good point. I hadn't though of it that way before.

And no Lotr was not better then the matrix. Lotr was just plain and simple about a ring. The Matrix is alot more in depth into human beliefs and many many other things.

Yeah right. I could go on for a loooong time about the deeper meanings in LotR. Way longer than I could go on about the Matrix....

Like Plumpamania said:

Lol, if it is a simple as a ring (you idiot) then Matrix is just based off a video game. Plain and simple. If you think that LoTR wasn't into human beliefs, feelings, battles, inner battles, and personifications and much more than you are on a level with an ashtray when it comes to intelligence. Go read the books and come back if you want to compete.

Haha, I totally agree with you. Anyone who says LotR was "simple" obviously hasn't read the books

 

[Static]

I think that the LotR's was bassically a fantasy movie and if it did have philosophical meaning i sure as hell missed it. I think it was abit perdictable... most movies are but they should of had one of the main character's die, like the elf, dwarf, or perhaps gandolf.

The battle's they were having... its just rediculous to have all the main characters live ( i dont see the king of rohan a main character).

With the Matrix i thought Zion was going to be destroyed.. cause it seemed like there were to many machines. Then when i was in the middle of watching the 3rd in the theaters (tripping) i was like... how is neo gonna pull this off. Then when trinity died i was like... that kinda sucked. Then I was like Neo can't kill smith. Then It stunned me when Neo was taken. But it took me awhile to realize why smith died.

Great movie.

 

[Malcom Sex]

Originally posted by cxoli

Umm, because there were too many and he wouldn't have been able to handle it in the event that ALL the machine were sent to attack Zion? Actually, I have no idea. I guess he figured the real problem was Agent Smith, and he could "buy" the safety of Zion for a longer period of time if he made a deal with the machines.

Did u not see how many little bombs there were. He was taking out thousands. Plus he would have only been exposed to a few at a time cause the only had a small space to come through

 

[cxoli]

I think that the LotR's was bassically a fantasy movie and if it did have philosophical meaning i sure as hell missed it. I think it was abit perdictable... most movies are but they should of had one of the main character's die, like the elf, dwarf, or perhaps gandolf.

The battle's they were having... its just rediculous to have all the main characters live ( i dont see the king of rohan a main character).

Of course the movie was basically just fantasy, there's way too much to fit into only nine hours. If you read the books, it's pretty easy to see the deeper meanings. Then again, it also depends on how you interpret it, just like everything else.

As for main characters dying, what does that have to do with making a movie/book good? Anyway, many of the main characters in the books had very minor roles in the movie, which made their deaths seem rather insignificant. However, in the books Boromir, Denethor, Theoden, and technically Gandalf all die, and it has pretty major impact. Also, in the books, you get a better idea of the characters' strength (ie their "advanced bloodlines," in a sense), so it makes sense when they don't die quite as easily as other people.

Well, whatever. It's kind of pointless for me to explain this if you haven't read the books

Did u not see how many little bombs there were. He was taking out thousands. Plus he would have only been exposed to a few at a time cause the only had a small space to come through

I don't know, kind of looked like their were tons of them swarming all over the place to me. Plus, if he would have stayed in Zion instead of going to negotiate with the machines, the machines eventually would have gone all-out and there would have been no way Neo could have stopped them.

 

[Static]

ok switching topics here... The philosophy of the matrix as a whole is impossible because they break it down into many different philosophies.

Cypher's choice to be reinserted in the matrix can be looked at from a philosophical point-of-view. In stead of living in the "desert of the real" he would rather live wonderfully in a dream. It brings up a question would you rather live happily as a pig or unhappy as a human. what would you do. I am not sure but i would prolly be the human.

 

[Plumpamania]

Okay you are officially the OFFICIAL ASS OF BATTLEFORUMS:

I said if you want to reply you better be ready to compete:

1). Gandalf died and came back (pay attention). Gandalf like Sauron is a member of the Maia, which is the exact same thing Sauron is. They are great spirits of Middle Earth, just not as strong as the Valar, but many more of them. For good and evil. Gandalf like Saruman and three other members of the Istari were sent to Middle Earth to combat Sauron to make sure the Darkness was kept to the East. But their oath said they cannot match their power against Saurons, which they could easily and they could not dominate Elves or Men.

2). Theoden is a MAIN character for he has everything to do with the story. His decision (in the movie) to go to Helm's Deep (in the book it was Gandalf's) and it was HIS decision to aid Gondor, so yes he is a main character.
2A). The death or Boromir was the first chapter of The Two Towers. Boromir plays a huge part to the Fellowship as it is reaction to the ring that brings about the break up for the Fellowship. Moron.

3). Main characters were always killed in LoTR, such as all of the High Kings of the Exiled nations that were Arnor and Gondor.

4). Arwen made the same choice that Elros and Elrond had to make and chose her MORTAL life.

5). Sauron died.-main enough?

6). If you thought LoTR was predictable please go back to Reloaded and watch in slow motion over and over again the scene were you get to see Keanu Reeve's as$. Matrix was horiffically predictable.

7). BASED OF A FREAKIN VIDEO GAME please re-read my post with the links in it.

8). Go and look at the highest grossing movies in America. All three LoTR movies are in the top then where as the Matrix doesn't have one in the top 15.

9). Matrix was based on a video game.

10). Zion was doomed if you understood the Architect. You KNEW what was going to happen, talk about the ruining of the forshadowing.

11). Do your HW if you want to compete child.

 

[Static]

I am talking die for good... gandalf coming back which me he didnt really die die.... that old wizard guy never really was showed being killed. He was just kinda chilling up in the tower... which he would of eventually died. Don't know who boremir or theoden ... Matrix was based of a video game... LotR was based off a book... does it matter.

as for the highest grossing movies there arent any porn movies and they are the best .... and LotR was more of a family/ fantasy type film.... something kids can enjoy. The matrix was a deep film and took more to understand.

Zion seemed to be doomed but if you saw the movie it wasnt so it was a surprise when neo was killed....

and who said we were competing.

 

[Plumpamania]

Matrix definetly wasn't more in depth than the Lord of the Rings. Its just your mind can't incorporate more than what your penis does. I bet you get hardons from Neo (thus me telling you to slow mo watch his as$ scene).

If you don't know who Boromir and Theoden is then don't try to talk about why you did/didn't like LoTR. Just say gee I'm a Matrix geek wow.

And btw, to disect your moronic post even more:

Gandalf is a spirit. He is almost like an angel. He can't die, just be resurrected. Same as Sauron. He was killed but survived because he attached his spirit, in essence himself to the ring.

And big deal, Neo and Trinity die. Who cares? Morpheus was the MAN of the trilogy. Matrix was just a series of flops after the first one.

Want to talk about the philosophical pov's behind the Matrix. They just renamed and replaced with more modern terms the bible and the koran. Its like you sitting down and telling an original Sci Fi Channel Original movie and adding it topics and scenes from the bible. Wow.

Close the thread.

 

[OMGLOLWTFPWN]

Doesn't Wormtongue stab saruman? If he did it wasn't in the movie, because I know in the third book the ring gets destroyed about 1/2 way through it. For some reason I thought Saruman showed up in hobbiton with wormtongue, who stabbed him and was then shot by the hobbits. (with bows not guns.)

If he does there's another main character dead.

Even if the matrix existed... would you care? I think I would be happy to live in this world (as long as I could get my memory wiped so I didn't know).

 

[Static]

ok i am talking about movie basis here... a book will always be more in depth then a movie... which is why people who read the books are always disapointed in the movies. We could throw down oppinions on which movie was better which movie was worse but oppinions get people no where. You can talk about how LotR was at the top but britney spears was also at the top and that is because she appeals to a bigger populous. She makes money because she has a nice set of breasts and shows them off... she cant sing, she never sings live. And shes making millions.

Some people don't like the Matrix, some people don't like LotR.

This thread is about Philosophy not the inner believes/battles/demons of anyone. The matrix touches that but thats not what the movie is mainly about. LotR had the inner stuff going on. And didn't make other's as apparent. The Matrix had alot of philosophy out in the open talking about choices/ determinism/causality/skeptisism/ and others. Story about socrates, plato, some other crap i cant remember cause they were greek. They made a book about it. and the book was only on the first matrix. the next 2 were jam packed w/ philosophy.

 

[Plumpamania]

B/c losers like you sit around and see who's thoughts and ideas, and any movements can be fit into them.

I bet if you did a google search you could find many people who have done the same for LoTR.

Pwned.

 

[Static]

....I enjoy philosophy. So i read philosophy books and one book which i am reading is called Philosophy and the Matrix. Not all of us can find the magic in LotR. That movie just don't work for everyone.

Just like the Matrix didn't really work for you as LotR worked for you... doesn't mean you have to flame people who think the Matrix is better than it.

 

[Plumpamania]

Can't take the heat then get outta the kitchen kiddo. Matrix was an inferior film followed devoutly by computer nerds (The EQ Kinds that skip school and work and everything else to get their ONE level-I have a friend who has).

Matrix had concepts that you could relate to many different things, but just saying that with the Matrix I could sit down with StarFox and tie in Christianity and Greek Myth plots into it, and make one helluva script.

Matrix blows.

 

[Static]

You can also say that LotR was followed devoutly by Fanstsy nerds... Like Star wars or everquest. That go to convestions and go to the movies dressed up as their favorite character. It happens with alot of triligy movies.

And saying the Matrix was a movie that only computer geeks like...It has some of the best fighting scenes i have seen in awhile.

I wouldn't expect anything less then a flame from someone who loves LotR so much that they put their location as the shire.

 

[Above_70Percent]

it was predictable cuz it was based on a book.... lol jp

 

[Plumpamania]

Static, if you really think the Matrix didn't have fags who dressed up you need to shoot yourself in the foot and simply say: "My bad!"

For everything you have said should require an immediate statement reading: "My bad!"

 

[Static]

I know people dressed like smith and neo... and other popular characters.... Thus why i said it happens with alot of triliogy movies... matrix was a triliogy was it not. People get inspiration from wherever they find it... wether it be a video game, bible, or philosophy.

In the matrix's sense they got the meat from a game and put philosophy and some biblical stories in there as well. I am not a fantasy type movie goer so i don't think LotR was better.